It’s time for the Spectacular Superhero Smackdown of 2012! Spider-Man vs. the Avengers vs. Batman. Which costumed crimefighter was the best of the summer? Vote in our poll.
I still haven’t seen ‘The Amazing Spider-Man’, nor do I really care to. I didn’t like any of the previous Spider-Man movies, and he’s just not a character that I care about. I’m not saying that it’s a bad movie (can’t judge what I haven’t seen), but I can’t drum up any enthusiasm for it.
Of the other two, ‘The Avengers’ wins by a country mile. I had some issues with the film, but it was great summer entertainment. Joss Whedon intuitively understood that comic book movies are supposed to be fun. I wish Christopher Nolan would learn that lesson.
Quite frankly, ‘The Dark Knight Rises’ bored me to tears. Who makes a three-hour Batman movie with barely ten minutes of Batman in it? More importantly, why? While I didn’t hate the film the way that, for example, I hated ‘Prometheus’, I found it lethargic and ridiculously self-important, and just no fun at all. It’s certainly the weakest of Nolan’s three Batman movies, with by far the worst script he’s ever written. Honestly, after watching it, I still have no idea what the villains’ plan or motivation or intent was. The plot made no sense to me at all, and I have no desire to revisit the film to piece it together.
Even in terms of sheer visual spectacle, ‘The Avengers’ wrangled its action scenes on a much grander, more epic scale. Its apocalyptic urban mayhem was much more convincing. ‘The Dark Knight Rises’ felt very small and underwhelming in comparison.
Maybe that’s just me. Which movie did you like best?
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HuskerGuy
Avengers>>>>>>>>>>Batman>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Spiderman
Avengers was just plain fun. Batman was just plain okay. Spiderman was just plain crap.
Nicholas Herum
Even though I thought The Avengers was light on plot it was more fun than The Dark Knight Rises. I enjoyed The Amazing Spider-Man but even with all its faults I still prefer The Dark Knight Rises over Spider-Man just because it involves Batman.
No one is more surprised by me that The Dark Knight Rises isn’t my favorite superhero film of the summer.
William Henley
I am seeing Dark Knight tomorrow.
Had no intrest in Spiderman, and The Avengers was a disappointment to me.
Was Captain America this year or last year? I really liked that!
Julian
Haha, well, since “Captain America” was the last film leading up to “The Avengers” and “The Avengers” started the summer early by being released in May, it’s quite impossible for “Captain America” to be a summer 2012 release.
William Henley
Um, I was thinking Captain America came out in like March or something. The poll isn’t for Summer 2012″ but for all of 2012. I just couldn’t remember exactly when it opened. Wait, hold on, let me pull up IMDB…..
Okay, it was summer 2011. Wow, this past year has REALLY gone by fast. I was honestly thinking it was like February or March of this year.
Julian
You’re right! The poll was “2012” as a whole. Sorry for that glaring oversight.
Jason
With direction by Joss Whedon and a solid portrayal of the characters I grew up with Avengers bests The Dark Knight and Spider-Man Reboot easily. I really feel that Christopher Nolan dropped the ball with sloppy writing, characters acting out of character and a meandering narrative that meanders.
Shannon Nutt
They were all entertaining…all three of them. But AVENGERS, as fun as it was, had a pretty paper-thin plot and a silly villain; while THE DARK KNIGHT RISES, for some of it’s flaws, was epic in scope and really tried to tell a complex and meaningful story. For that reason, it gets my vote…since I think I’ll still be watching TDKR years from now, when I’ve all but forgotten about AVENGERS.
Nicholas Herum
I’ve wondered how well The Avengers will play in years to come after multiple viewings. I’ve seen it twice and I’ll undoubtedly watch it again so I can write a Blu-ray review but I could see it becoming a bit dull since its not a very complicated movie.
Cameron
I didn’t want to vote that they all stunk, but all three didn’t really meet my expectations. Avengers was like a screensaver: plotless eye-candy, but still a lot of fun. I don’t even have the time to go over why Spider-Man sucked! The Dark Knight Rises had the same character, editing, and logistical issues as The Dark Knight, but it had a great villain, and at least attempted a complex plot. So Rises wins in my book.
Drew
Both ‘The Avengers’ and ‘The Dark Knight Rises’ are superb in their own way. Personally, I pick ‘TDKR’ hands down. It is superior to ‘The Avengers’ in almost every measurable way that matters when you consider the aspects that make up a quality film.
Everyone who is saying some of the following: the plot has holes, the intent of the villains is unclear, there’s not enough Batman, things don’t make sense, there are continuity issues or inconsistencies, etc., about ‘TDKR’, need to go and see it again. Upon first repeat viewing, the narrative is much smoother, and certain aspects that were a little bit vague the first time around, really come into focus. There were comments, and an argument in the poll post, about Wayne’s fingerprints not being needed, and Bane not needing to take over the stock exchange in order to accomplish a trade, and bankrupt Wayne. I was laughing at all of it, because it was clear that the people commenting didn’t even understand that entire subplot. They were trying to use it as an example of mistakes made in the script, or a plot hole, and didn’t even have an awareness of what was actually occurring during the related scenes.
I’ve seen ‘TDKR’ 5 times now. Each time I watch it again, something new and intriguing is revealed. There are no plot holes, inconsistencies, or aspects that don’t make sense. The intent and motivation of both Bane and Talia is crystal clear. I think this film was simply too vast and epic for a lot of people to fully comprehend, and they missed a lot of little details that tied up anything they perceived to be a plot hole or mistake.
‘TDKR’ is a superb film in any genre. ‘The Avengers’ is merely a great comic book/superhero film.
Josh Zyber
Author“Everyone who is saying some of the following… need to go and see it again.”
The problem is that the movie is so BORING that I never want to sit through it again.
Jason
TDKR was a mess. hardly a superb film in any genre. The Avengers was the perfect summer blockbuster movie. The kind of movie that afterwards you feel amped about. TDKR made me want to take a nap. both times I saw it!
There’s nothing intricate or subtle in TDKR, no great unraveling story beneath the surface. Christopher Nolan is no Terrence Malick. I liked The Dark Knight and loved Inception but TDKR uhg gag me with a spoon.
Penny: “But, he turned out to be totally sweet. Sometimes people are layered like that. There’s something totally different underneath than what’s on the surface.”
Dr. Horrible: “And sometimes there’s a third, even deeper level, and that one is the same as the top surface one. Like with pie.”
Ted S.
” TDKR made me want to take a nap. both times I saw it!”
I love this quote, let me ask you this, if it was so boring the first time you saw it, why the hell did you go see it again?
I enjoyed both The Avengers and TDKR equally, I might lean more towards TDKR more after I see it again.
Nicholas Herum
“I think this film was simply too vast and epic for a lot of people to fully comprehend, and they missed a lot of little details that tied up anything they perceived to be a plot hole or mistake.”
I consider myself a relatively smart moviegoer and I’m no stranger to saying things that sound condescending but what you just said is a bunch of malarkey. To say you just went into full FANBOY mode is an understatement.
I enjoyed The Dark Knight Rises and I will gladly add it to my Blu-ray collection but it is an immensely imperfect film.
RollTide1017
“There were comments, and an argument in the poll post, about Wayne’s fingerprints not being needed, and Bane not needing to take over the stock exchange in order to accomplish a trade, and bankrupt Wayne. I was laughing at all of it, because it was clear that the people commenting didn’t even understand that entire subplot. They were trying to use it as an example of mistakes made in the script, or a plot hole, and didn’t even have an awareness of what was actually occurring during the related scenes.”
It would be nice if you would actually try and explain why you think the scenes do work instead of just insulting people.
Drew
‘The Amazing Spider-Man’ was the opposite of it’s title. It was barely above standard superhero fare. As I said before, it was an indie romance with a comic book film stashed inside. Not really what salivating Spider-Man fans have in mind when they think of the latest, greatest Spidey movie.
Drew
Josh,
It’s not boring at all. Quite the contrary. It’s exhilarating. This is clearly a case of you making up your mind about it, before you saw it, with a dash of your infamous stubborness thrown in for good measure.
Just the fact that you keep saying it only has 10 minutes of Batman in it is proof enough. Batman is in it for about 40 – 50 minutes.
How long is Hulk in ‘The Avengers’? 5 – 10 minutes? I don’t hear you complaining about that.
Josh Zyber
Author“It’s not boring at all. Quite the contrary. It’s exhilarating.”
Obviously, I disagree with you. So does my wife. So do, so far, about 140 of the voters in our poll in the other Dark Knight post. Perhaps not a majority, but also certainly not a sentiment that I’m alone in.
“This is clearly a case of you making up your mind about it, before you saw it, with a dash of your infamous stubborness thrown in for good measure.”
I liked both of Nolan’s prevous Batman movies. I had not heard anything overwhelmingly negative about this one. I had no reason to expect that I wouldn’t like it.
“How long is Hulk in ‘The Avengers’? 5 – 10 minutes? I don’t hear you complaining about that.”
That movie isn’t called ‘The Hulk Rises’, now is it?
William Henley
I got to agree with you, Josh. I saw it today. There were some good moments, but the movie as a whole was boring. I nodded off once or twice. Now don’t get me wrong, the movie wasn’t bad, but it was nowhere near as good as the previous two.
As for how I voted, I chose “They all stunk”. Okay, I didn’t bother with Spiderman, and I did The Avengers was okay. But as there was no option for “They are okay” I went with “They stunk”. Both were disappointments.
And yes, I saw TDKR on a TRUE Imax screen. It looked beautiful. I wish more movies were shot like this. Too bad the movie just wasn’t that good.
Jason
third act of The Avengers = AMAZING!
third act of The Dark Knight Rises = “hey, wake up you’re drooling in my popcorn.”
motorheadache
I’m gonna have to go with Avengers, even though I also really liked Dark Knight Rises. Avengers gets the nod from me because it managed to surpass my expectations, whereas I thought DKR was good in it’s own right but not quite up there with the previous film.
Amazing Spider-Man? It wasn’t a bad film, not at all. It had the awkward task of having to retell the origin story and establish it’s own style and tone from the Raimi films. I think it will start an overall better series of films than the previous ones, and I’m hoping for great things beginning with part 2.
Drew
Jason,
You’re wrong. Period. ‘TDKR’ is extremely intricate. I’m sorry you missed so many of the crucial undertones of it. There is something quite profound bubbling under the surface during almost every minute of it. It’s a shame you didn’t pick up on this.
With that said, I do agree with everything you say about ‘The Avengers’. I love it!
RollTide1017
Again, you don’t even try to explain what is so profound about the movie. I’m seriously interested in reading your thoughts. I found the other opinions interesting to read but, you are not offering a true rebuttal.
At least those who didn’t like the movie give clear thoughts about why they don’t like it. The people who disagree with them never try to refute what they say and just make claims of how profound it is under the surface by saying everyone else just missed it. Well, could one of you please explain this profoundness by saying more then “it’s a shame you didn’t pick up on this.”
Drew
Josh,
Okay. We can agree to disagree. That’s fine.
I wasn’t ever suggesting that you had heard anything overtly negative about it. That wouldn’t seem plausible, because the praise for it is almost universal. Just look at your poll. About 80% think that it’s either a masterpiece, or at least quite good. I was just sensing that you had already decided that you weren’t going to like it.
I’ll concede to your point about Hulk. I was merely using that as an example of a major character not needing to take up the bulk of the time in order to have a major impact. Even so, 40-50 minutes of Batman is a hell of a lot more than the 10 you keep citing incorrectly. Perhaps you’re exaggerating for effect, but it comes off as you trying to stir the pot.
Gareth Callenby
Avengers hit its mark and made it look nearly effortless (the squabbling aboard the helicarrier lasts a couple minutes too long to be interesting).
The Dark Knight Rises, despite being grimmer, darker, can also be boneheaded too, whether it’s jarring flashbacks, implausibly convenient timing to save a character’s life, or a campy finale that seems to be lifted straight out of the Adam West TV series.
I thought the pit and the sudden Gotham crazyocracy were pretty awesome on their own cheeseball terms, but they were a stark shift away from the well-wrought triumvirate drama that made the middle film so compelling and heart-wrenching. Instead of interesting human drama in this film, you have a return to the Campbellian hero archetype used in the first film. It’s more compelling in this film than the first, but it’s still a significant step down from the second.
The Dark Knight Rises is deathly dark, yes, but it’s just not smart enough.
Ian Whitcombe
More like, the ending was lifted from the Adam West *movie*…
http://cdn.screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/Adam-West-Bomb-Dark-Knight-Rises.jpg
Jason
that’s perfect!
Dave Kaye
Hands down for Dark Knight Rises. Loved Spider-Man but it’s a distant 2nd. DKR is also my favorite film of the year
Alan Bratschi
I really enjoyed all three, with Amazing Spider-Man being my least favorite. The Avengers and The Dark Knight Rises are almost too different for me to compare. Totally opposite in tone, even though they are both based on comic book heroes. The thing that always draws me to The Dark Knight trilogy is that Christopher Nolan tries to make things feel real- even the really outlandish parts. The Iron Man films felt that way, too, but The Avengers had aliens, gods, etc. And I did really enjoy Avengers, but I’m drawn to stories that are dark in tone, and have a sense of realism to them. The Dark Knight series explained his training, his costume, his gadgets and his vehicles. The villains had clear motives, and were more realistic versions of their comic book counterparts. That’s what did it for me.
Andy
1) Dark Knight Rises all the way – weight, depth, emotion & Batman, what’s not to like? A different tone, a different world to the avangers – two incomparable movies.
2) The Avengers – Whedon knocked it out of the park (as expected) for some family friendly popcorn munching superhero entertainment.
3) Spiderman – Not terrible by any stretch but way too soon after the last trilogy, just felt a bit pointless establishing the same backstory. Again.
xcalibur
All but one are superhero movies – THE DARK KNIGHT TRILOGY IS SOMETHING ELSE ENTIRELY – IT IS LEGEND.
K. R. J.
I am a DC guy. I am a Batman guy. I have a room in my house called The Batcave – full of Batman stuff. I was so disappointed in TDKR that I created a FB note and cited the problems … I’m up to 22. My biggest gripe was that there was no evolution from Dark Knight. Bruce Wayne/Batman were a step behind … well, everybody. Nolan did not create a Batman that is true to the character: Batman is the World’s Greatest Detective, Batman doesn’t quit, Batman wouldn’t lay in Bane’s lap crying about a woman’s betrayal.
I am shocked at how many people are raving about how awesome TDKR is. Was Idiocracy a prophecy?
My vote goes to Avengers.
Felix Bee
The problem with creating a movie about a superhero/superheroes is that we all have a preconceived notion of how said superhero should act and feel; therefore, there will never be a one size fits all superhero movie. To all those who feel they could have done better with respect to any of these films, please feel free to write a script, have said script picked up by a major Hollywood studio, and let the world see it brought to life…
Josh Zyber
AuthorHollywood studios don’t just pick up scripts and put them directly on screen. You could write the single greatest screenplay in the history of all movies, but by the time it’s produced, it will have been re-written at least 75 times by dozens of people with endless “notes” from meddling studio executives and test screening audiences, until what winds up on screen bears no resemblance to one single word you wrote. What may start as the ‘War and Peace’ of screenplays will somehow be transformed into ‘Paul Blart, Mall Cop 2: Blarts Afire’. This is why 90% of everything that comes out of Hollywood is crap.
This “You think you can do better, go write your own movie” argument doesn’t hold water, because that’s just not how Hollywood works – especially not with mega-budget summer tentpole movies or licensed properties.
If you think no one is allowed to criticize a movie they don’t like if they’ve never written and produced a feature film themselves, then by the same token, you shouldn’t be allowed to praise that movie either, because you are equally unqualified to judge.
JM
Is there any evidence that Josh likes movies?
In the last 10 years, has he given 5 stars to anything?
Has he ever professed love for a summer blockbuster?
Is this critic addiction? Endless consumption, without satisfaction.
Like most, I frequent this blog for the keen Zyber snark.
But I can’t recall him ever enjoying a movie.
Josh Zyber
AuthorI loved the last Mission: Impossible. I suppose that was technically released in the fall, though. I liked the previous Dark Knight movie well enough.
I don’t hand out five star scores easily, because I really believe they should be reserved for the absolute best of the best, which only come around rarely.
Barsoom Bob
He likes Dune, God bless him, and so do I.
I think I have figured out what sets the Zyber Attack off.
When he is really psyched for a film and then it goes off in another direction than what he wanted, it gets personal.
Avatar – he wanted Aliens Redux but got tree huggers.
Drive – He wanted a smarter Fast and Furious but got a car noir.
Prometheus – he wanted an Alien movie but got
Ancient Aliens
The level of vitrol is propotional to how badly he was let down from what he wanted, not from what was actually up on the screen.
This is just my speculation and I don’t mean any denegration towards anyone, we are all just human. It has just puzzled me for a while why he sometimes gets so negativo on some movies.
Josh Zyber
Author“The level of vitrol is propotional to how badly he was let down from what he wanted”
This much I will agree with.^
“not from what was actually up on the screen.”
This much I will not.
“Avatar – he wanted Aliens Redux but got tree huggers.
Drive – He wanted a smarter Fast and Furious but got a car noir.
Prometheus – he wanted an Alien movie but got Ancient Aliens”
No, in all three of these cases I wanted movies that were not stupid. What I got instead were movies that WERE stupid.
I can enjoy a dumb movie that knows that it’s dumb and doesn’t pretend to be otherwise. But when a movie comes out with pretentions of being THE GREATEST THING IN THE HISTORY OF ALL THINGS EVER, and it turns out to be a totally idiotic p.o.s., that’s when my ire gets raised.
In case I haven’t said it enough, I do not hate Dark Knight Rises the way that I hated Prometheus or Drive (or to a lesser extent Avatar). I just didn’t like it very much.
JM
For whatever it’s worth, I like reading the cinema you love as much as the snark.
Your marathon about Lynch is the kind of uniqueness I was excited to see posted.
Perhaps with three jobs, the poetry of rage is the most therapeutic to pound out.
Ted S.
You’ll love this discussion about Into the Wild, Zyber went a little ape shit on the guy who refuses to see it:
http://forums.highdefdigest.com/blu-ray-software-general-discussion/75420-into-wild-high-def-digest-review.html
Josh, I always love reading your hatred of films that didn’t lived up to your expectations, keep it up buddy. Watch out for this Drew though, he seems to really try to rile you up.
Josh Zyber
AuthorI was going to object, but then I skimmed through that thread again and, yeah, I guess I was a little… aggressive. 🙂
I have a very low tolerance for people who revel in their own ignorance.
William Henley
Aww, come on, the Drew / Josh rivalry is one of the best parts of the comments section!
Drew
Oh C’mon, stop it now. There have been times when I have been Josh’s strongest supporter, and there has been no bigger Zyber advocate.
Film preservation is just one topic where I have fought tooth and nail to make sure that his statements are given the proper respect, and hopefully agreed with.
The only major contentious topics have been those in which I perceive that he is arbitrarily structuring his opinion, in what feels like an effort to get a rise out of as many people as possible.
K. R. J.
How does Bane eat … or brush his teeth?
Brian Hoss
Very painfully… for you!
Shayne Blakeley
Haven’t seen Spiderman yet, but I can’t imagine it could stand up to the other two. That said, it’s Avengers for me by a mile. While I enjoyed TDKR immensely, not everything worked for me, and overall it’s my least favorite of the series. The thing that really makes the difference for me is how damn fun Avengers is. I have no doubt that I’ll be able to watch that movie over and over and never not have a huge shit-eating grin on my face, I can’t say that that will be case with TDKR.