Game of Thrones 8.05

Game of Thrones 8.05 Recap: “Let It Be Fear”

The penultimate episode of Game of Thrones feels in many ways like the climax of the entire series. After watching it, the biggest question I had is what the show’s seemingly countless disgruntled fans would find to complain about in this one.

Following the death of Missandei, Daenerys somehow managed to restrain herself from flying into an immediate rage, and pulled back to Dragonstone to await the arrival of the Northern armies while her Unsullied and the remaining Dothraki lay siege to the capital. During this time, Varys has been actively plotting against her by sending notes via raven informing pretty much all of Westeros that Jon Snow is the rightful heir to the throne. One of Varys’ little bird spies notifies him that the queen hasn’t eaten in days, leaving an impression that perhaps he’s been trying to poison her – or at least that she fears someone might. Or perhaps she’s just sunken into an inconsolable depression.

Jon Snow arrives by boat ahead of his army. Varys gets to him first and attempts to throw in with him, urging him to consider the possibility of taking the throne himself. Jon won’t listen. He insists that he’s still loyal to his queen.

Tyrion speaks with Daenerys intending to tell her that someone has betrayed her. She already expected as much, though she assumed it would be Jon Snow. She seems disappointed when Tyrion tells her it was Varys. Nonetheless, she connects that dots that Varys learned about Jon’s parentage from Tyrion, and in turn that it’s Jon Snow’s fault for blabbing to Sansa after she ordered him not to. She feels betrayed by everyone.

Varys doesn’t seem surprised at all when Grey Worm and some soldiers march to his quarters to arrest him. In the middle of the night, they bring him to the beach, where Daenerys and her inner circle stand waiting to pass judgment. Tyrion admits to Varys that he sold him out. Varys isn’t upset. All he can say is that he hopes for the whole kingdom’s sake that he’s wrong and Daenerys will turn out to be a just and fair ruler after all. The two old friends say their goodbyes, and Dany’s dragon almost silently pokes its head out of the darkness. With little more than a whisper, Daenerys utters the kill command, “Dracarys,” and the dragon incinerates Varys on the spot. Jon is shaken and visibly shows signs of doubting his queen.

Afterward, Jon has a private conversation with Daenerys. She assesses her situation coldly: “I don’t have love here. I only have fear.” Jon protests that he loves her, but when Daenerys tests this by trying to kiss him, he pulls back. In her mind, this proves her right. She is once again alone in the world.

Tyrion later pleads with Daenerys again not to harm the thousands of innocents inside King’s Landing, but she seems set in her plan to sack the city. He assures her that the people will turn against Cersei and signal their surrender by ringing the city’s bells. He begs her to listen for the bells and call off her attack if she hears them. Daenerys consents to this, doubting that it will happen anyway. Before he leaves, Daenerys informs Tyrion that his brother Jaime was caught while riding to King’s Landing. She ends the conversation with the threat, “The next time you fail me will be the last time you fail me.”

As morning approaches, masses of people continue to flood into King’s Landing seeking refuge from the mad Dragon Queen they’ve been told is coming to senselessly kill them all. The Hound and Arya ride right through the Lannister army by convincing a soldier that there’s no point in him stopping them.

Tyrion asks Davos to smuggle something for him, but we don’t get to learn what it was just yet. Tyrion then goes to speak with Jaime in a prison tent. He sets his brother free, asking him to speak to Cersei and convince her to change her course of action. Jaime thinks that Cersei may still have a chance to come out on top in this conflict, but Tyrion is confident that the war is already over and the city will fall no matter what. He tells Jaime about a secret escape tunnel beneath the Red Keep (the one he used when he escaped imprisonment) that will lead to a waiting dinghy. He begs him to ring the bells and open the city gates, then flee with Cersei and start a new life together far away from the capital. The two brothers hug before departing.

The Assault

The sun rises. Euron and his Iron Fleet stand at the ready waiting for the battle to begin. Lannister soldiers line the castle walls, a number of them manning dragon-killing scorpion weapons. The city battens down for the conflict. Arya and the Hound make their way inside. On the desert side of the city, the Golden Company army stand outside the walls, facing the armies of the North.

Tyrion tells Jon Snow about the bells that will signal a surrender. They wait and listen, hearing nothing.

Cersei is cocky. She orders the city gates closed, locking out masses of panicked commoners. Jaime is trapped outside. He turns back and heads toward the shore.

It’s a calm, quiet day. In contrast to the last major battle on this show, the sun shines brightly, illuminating everything. Daenerys cleverly uses this to her advantage. Masked by the bright of the sun, she and Drogon fly in from directly above and dive-bomb the Iron Fleet. Euron isn’t as prepared as he thought he was. Daenerys, on the other hand, has learned from her last encounter. Although the ships launch a volley of scorpion bolts, the dragon dodges and weaves between them, blasting the ships with fire. She quickly devastates the Iron Fleet and turns her attention to the scorpion turrets and archers on the city walls. None of them can hit her as she flies low and moves quickly to set them ablaze. The battle has just begun, and it’s already incredibly one-sided.

On the other side of the city, the first sounds of the destruction begin to reach the standing armies. The Golden Company aren’t even sure what’s happening when the wall behind them suddenly explodes from the inside out and crushes many of them. Daenerys flies her dragon straight over. The Unsullied, Dothraki, and Northern armies charge in, easily mopping up any survivors. They swarm into the city, bringing death and destruction to any forces standing in their way. The civilians in the city panic and flee toward the center.

From her perch in the Red Keep, Cersei can see that the tide has turned. She’s not so cocky anymore, but tries to remain defiant, insisting “All we need is one good shot.” Even that mood deflates when Qyburn tells her that the Iron Fleet has been wiped out and all the scorpions were destroyed. They have no more dragon-killing weapons.

When Daenerys’ armies reach them, the soldiers of the Kingsguard can see that the war is lost. They drop their swords. Across the city, calls cry out to ring the bells. Daenerys and Drogon take a perch atop a building and wait. A tense moment passes. Although Cersei cannot concede defeat herself, the bells start ringing, signaling surrender. Jon Snow looks relieved. If this is the end of the war, the cost could have been much higher.

Fury and Fire

Daenerys hears the bells, but cannot be satisfied by the victory. She doesn’t want a surrender. She wants total annihilation of her enemies. Seething with hatred, she flies Drogon toward the Red Keep and rains fire down onto the city, torching countless innocents in the streets below.

When the Kinsguard turn to see what’s happening, Grey Worm follows his queen’s lead and tosses a spear into the leader’s back. The scene quickly deteriorates into chaos. The Lannister soldiers pick up their swords to defend themselves, and Daenerys’ forces slaughter them. Jon Snow is in shock. Watching from outside the city, Tyrion is as well. Daenerys has become exactly the Mad Queen that Cersei portrayed her as.

Daenerys flies over the city, systematically destroying building after building, working inwards toward the Red Keep. On the streets, the armies take advantage of the opportunities to pillage and murder without discretion. Jon has to kill one of his own soldiers for trying to rape a woman, but he’s powerless to stop the tide flowing over the city.

Jaime makes his way to the dinghy on the shore that Tyrion told him about, planning to enter the city through the secret passage. He’s stopped by Euron Greyjoy, who washes ashore at the same location. Euron goads him into a fight, promising to deliver his head as a gift to Cersei. They struggle, and Euron stabs Jaime in each side of his torso, but Jaime manages to impale Euron through the stomach with his sword. Euron knows that he’s done for, but he also knows that Jaime’s wounds will be fatal as well. “Another king for you,” he laughs as Jaime limps toward the tunnel. Despite his defeat, Euron is pleased to be the man who killed Jaime Lannister.

Daenerys begins her assault on the Red Keep itself just as Arya and the Hound enter. The Hound tells Arya to go home. She insists that she’s determined to get her revenge, but the Hound convinces her that it’s pointless. While he has no choice but to press forward and face his brother, he implores her not to be like him. There’s no sense in Arya dying when Cersei is as good as dead anyway.

In denial that the Red Keep will fall, Cersei doesn’t want to leave. Finally, Qyburn talks sense into her. In the process of retreating, they’re stopped in a stairwell by the Hound, who kills their Kingsguard escort. The Mountain steps forward and ignores Cersei’s order to stay by her side. He shoves Qyburn out of the way, slamming him into a wall with enough force to kill him. The Hound has no interest in Cersei and allows her to pass alone as he faces his brother.

The Hound is a seasoned fighter, but is nonetheless outmatched by the giant zombie beast that the Mountain has become. He manages to knock his brother’s helmet off and stab him through the gut, but the Mountain refuses to die. He picks up the Hound by his head and crushes his eyeballs. The Hound scrambles for a dagger and stabs it directly into his brother’s forehead. Even that doesn’t stop the monster. He drops the Hound and stumbles back a step, but reaches up and pulls the dagger out. Blinded but not dead, the Hound charges the Mountain and knocks him through an exterior wall. Both brothers plummet off the side of the castle into a blazing inferno below. Terrified of fire for most of his life, the Hound was perhaps always destined to die in flames.

Cersei works her way downstairs and runs into Jaime. The two embrace and Jaime leads her to the basement. However, he finds their exit blocked by rubble. Cersei pleads with him to save her. She wants their baby to live. Jaime brings her close, tells her “Nothing else matters, only us,” and holds her until the castle collapses down on top of them.

Jon Snow orders his army to fall back and leave the city. Some do, but it’s unclear how many stay to continue marauding.

While trying to escape, Arya bears witness to the horrors of the city as Daenerys continues burning it to the ground. Throughout King’s Landing, explosions of green fire erupt, presumably the result of hidden stores of wildfire. Arya is nearly trampled by a mob, but is saved by the compassion of a random woman. She’s injured and winds up in a shelter with a bunch of terrified commoners, including that woman and her young child. Arya convinces them that they’re not safe and tries to lead them out. The woman is wounded and begs Arya to save her daughter, but the girl refuses to leave her mother. Arya watches helplessly as the both of them are incinerated in a Daenerys fly-by.

When the devastation finally seems to subside, Arya is banged-up and covered in Ash. She looks like she has PTSD. The episode ends with her finding a white horse (perhaps the one the Golden Company commander rode earlier) standing confused in the middle of a street. She mounts and rides it out.

Episode Verdict

In the wake of this episode airing, I made the mistake of reading some of the inevitable complaints about it online. A lot of people seem to be upset that Daenerys’ turn to the dark side was supposedly too sudden. I can’t agree. It’s been foreshadowed since practically the moment we first met her in Season 1, and the events of previous episodes this season made it an inevitability. In Daenerys’s mind, anyone who ever supported her has either died or eventually betrayed her.

What the criticisms also don’t take into consideration is that Daenerys didn’t actually go insane, but rather knew exactly what she was doing. She had decided earlier in the episode that she’d never win the love of the people and the only way to rule was by fear. As a Targaryen, that’s a philosophy she’d been taught since birth. As much as she tried to reject it until now, recent events convinced her of its validity.

Accepting a surrender wouldn’t be enough to secure Daenerys’ rule as queen. People might cheer for the overthrow, but would ultimately drift toward Jon Snow (a much more beloved figure) or other possible usurpers. Destroying the entire city was Daenerys sending the message, “Don’t even think of turning against me.” The fear she wanted to instill was not just in her enemies or the commoners, but in Jon Snow and all his supporters. She’s telling them that she doesn’t need them. She was single-handedly responsible for winning the war, and anyone who thinks of betraying her will get the same treatment.

Unlike the last episode, I honestly can’t criticize any character’s decision-making in this one, even if I don’t agree with the outcomes. Daenerys had a strong strategy going into this conflict, executed exactly as she wanted it.

I could probably nit-pick a few things in the episode. The so-called “Clegane Bowl” duel between the Hound and the Mountain was too blatantly played for fan-service. The likelihood that Euron Greyjoy would wash ashore at precisely the place and time that Jaime happened to be there is also fairly implausible. And it’s disappointing that Yara Greyjoy had no part in killing her uncle (although, frankly, that probably would have been too much fan-service as well).

Nevertheless, I feel like I’m out of step with a lot of Game of Thrones fandom this season. Even if the episodes aren’t flawless, the scope and scale of what they’re achieving is unprecedented for television, and even dwarfs most feature film franchises. The apocalyptic destruction in this episode left me in awe. I doubt we’ll ever see anything like this on TV again.

I also think that most of the character arcs are progressing toward satisfying conclusions, and that Jaime and Cersei got a fitting end.

91 comments

  1. Timcharger

    As much as I’ve nitpicked (and major-picked) on this show, I do agree that the recent hate from the fans of the show are as if they are like Daenerys, choosing to watch from fear & hate than from love.

    I am marveled by the spectacle, the production, the music, the craftwork of the filmmaking.

    Despite my quibbles, I am getting my money’s worth in entertainment. But there’s 1 more episode left to change all that. My wife thinks twice now about wearing her “Mother of Dragons” shirt. I have yet to want to cast my GoT merchandise into the flames.

    • Timcharger

      There is an unusual circumstance that can explain much of the disagreements with the storytelling. GRRM only has the big beats determined. The showrunners have to make up the connective tissue between these predetermined big beats. It’s GRRM’s fault that the connective tissue hasn’t been completed. Normal show writing would alter the big beats if the connective tissue doesn’t quite come together well. Benioff and Weiss are forced to write in a most strange way. My guess to why the books haven’t been coming out for 9 years now (the entire length of the show) is because GRRM is having a hard time connecting the big plot beats together, too.

  2. Timcharger

    Josh (after writing much to defend Daenerys): “Unlike the last episode, I honestly can’t criticize any character’s decision-making in this one.”

    So if HDD isn’t ruled with love, you’ll chose to rule with fear? Never ever EVER give Josh the power of dragons.
    🙂

    • Timcharger

      Josh: “I honestly can’t criticize any character’s decision-making in this one…”

      In your impassioned defense, you didn’t mention Tyrion’s decision-making or Jaime’s choices.

      • Timcharger

        Tyrion still appealing to Cersei (through Jaime) to surrender and flee for a peaceful quiet life to raise their inbred child in powerless poverty (or whatever life you can buy with a gold hand), this decision-making is so questionable. How many attempts will Tyrion make based on his belief that Cersei isn’t a monster, after all these seasons of Cersei being a monster? Tyrion tried before Cersei deceived them with the false team-up against the Night King. Tyrion tried again with Missandei’s beheading. When will the brilliant Tyrion learn?

        Tyrion could have still released Jaime to repay him for the same kindness. But it would be so much more powerful if Tyrion made Jaime swear to flee north. To swear to go back to Winterfell and to Brienne. Jaime would make that promise to Tyrion. But in a following scene, we see Jaime sneaking into King’s Landing instead. This would parallel how after Jaime helped Tyrion escape, Tyrion didn’t go straight to the fleeing ship, but went back to see Tywin instead.

        • Josh Zyber
          Author

          Tyrion was trying to avoid mass slaughter in the capital, and the only way he saw for that to happen was for Cersei to surrender. Although a long shot, he had to try. If anything could convince Cersei to give up rather than stay and die, it was offering her the possibility of a life with Jaime.

          There was no other play for Tyrion to make. If he left Jaime a prisoner, Daenerys would execute him. Freeing him was the only way to give Jaime a chance to live. At the same time, he knew that Jaime wouldn’t flee north no matter what he made him swear. Nothing could stop him from going to Cersei. As such, all Tyrion could do was hope that Jaime would be successful in talking some sense into Cersei. It was their only chance, even if remote.

          What Tyrion couldn’t foresee (or at least had no way of stopping) was Daenerys refusing the surrender and destroying the city anyway.

          • Timcharger

            You write about the certainty of that Dany WOULD execute Jaime (though he remained held alive in decent shape; no signs of torture), yet in the same argument you suggest that Dany WOULD NOT execute Cersei with her unborn child, if Cersei surrendered.

            The smart play would be to counsel Dany what Tyrion knows very well. Tyrions knows exactly which balcony is Cersei’s favorite to sip wine at. Want to stop the slaughter of innocents? Put all attention to go straight at the guilty. Tyrion, tell Dany where Cersei would be watching the battle from. Tell her where Cersei would retreat to. Have the greatest smuggler in the land, smuggle Grey Worm and his elite guard into the Red Keep. The play to satisfy a bloodthirsty conqueror? Feed the dragon, lion meat, Tyrion.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Where did I suggest that Dany wouldn’t execute Cersei? Of course she would. That’s why Tyrion tried to give Cersei an out, by offering her a chance to escape with Jaime.

          • Timcharger

            So why would Cersei surrender then? That’s my point. Flee to only to be chased by dragons across the realms without a city’s defenses to fend off dragons and assassins? Surrender is not an option for Cersei; she’s not that stupid. For Tyrion to continue to sue for that is stupidity. It’s not just Ned Stark would didn’t understand. Tyrion doesn’t know that in the game of thrones, you win or you die.

            This is the same mistake. Ned offered Cersei a chance to flee to save her then 3 children. Tyrion offerring Cersei a chance to escape (guess a dinghy was smuggled in for her to flee) means that Tyrion might need to face the same fate as Ned.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Cersei’s options are certain death, or the possibility of escape, even if difficult. If it were just her alone, she’d probably stay to the end. But she’s pregnant with Jaime’s child. That gives her a motivation for wanting to live. She expresses this herself in her last moments.

            Tyrion acknowledges in dialogue that his actions may get him executed, and he’s prepared to die. As I said, he had no other play. This was his only shot at possibly stopping the destruction of the city. If it worked, he’d save thousands of people. If he did nothing, the city was certain to be destroyed, Jaime would be executed, and Daenerys would probably find a reason to execute him as well anyway. He knows that he’s already on her last nerve.

          • Timcharger

            Josh, think about what would happen if Tyrion’s play succeeds? If Cersei was able to successfully flee in the middle of the battle, that would satisfy a mad dragon queen? If Tyrion is fearful of the destruction of the city, his plan would to make it so Dany would tear apart the whole city searching for the escaped Cersei? What is part 2 of Tyrion’s escape plan for Cersei? That Cersei would announce that she is NOT in King’s Landing but reveal her hiding place away for the innocent people of the city?.

            Remember how just about every little person in the realm was killed because Cersei wanted Tyrion dead? So every (seemingly) pregnant, short haired girl will be killed for the bounty on Cersei’s head?

            —–

            Josh, why do you keep saying helping Cersei flee was Tyrion’s only play to avoid the destruction of the city? Helping Dany kill her ultimate nemesis is the best play. You don’t want Dany mad, then give her what makes her happy. Afraid that Dany will carpet bomb the streets? Give Dany precise targets to hit at the Red Keep instead. Cleverly arrange Seal Team Unsullied 6 to be smuggled into the Red Keep from the hidden passageways Tyrion knows. There’s so many different plays.

            It’s one thing to dismiss the haters’ criticism of the writing. But it’s a whole other thing to keep defending the show with a “only 1 play” possible defense. Goodness really? The writing for Tyrion was perfect? There’s no other possible play? You don’t believe that.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Tyrion couldn’t guarantee that Cersei would be in a particular location in the Red Keep. Nor could he be sure that a direct assault on the Red Keep was possible without devastating the city with a massive loss of life, because he knows that Cersei surrounded the Red Keep with a buffer of civilians. Cersei would also be expecting assassination attempts and would be prepared for them. (The Mountain never left her side.) Convincing Cersei to surrender was his best chance to spare the innocents in the city.

            I read someone summarize the complaints about this season pretty succinctly. The fans wrote their own fan fiction for what they want to happen in the show, and can’t accept it when the actual episodes don’t follow their outlines. That’s exactly what you’re doing now.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Just read this comment on another forum (credit to “bobby94928”):

            “Dany didn’t go directly to the Red Keep because she wanted Cersei to watch her burn the entire city first. She wanted Cersei to see that her arrogance caused all of this. She wanted her to know that no one would mourn her death because no one was alive to do the mourning….”

          • Timcharger

            No, I liked the episode. I really did. Were there bad parts, yes, you mentioned them in your recap (Euron’s convenience, almost forgot to mention the giant Hound wandering into the city with a hoodie, totally good disguise; he’s a whole head taller than the fleeing masses). Parts could be improved. Except for some reason, Tyrion’s choices cannot be improved upon, according to you. It’s me suggesting possible other plays in response to your only-1-play claim, it’s me writing the fan fiction.

          • Timcharger

            Josh: “Cersei would also be expecting assassination attempts and would be prepared for them. (The Mountain never left her side.)”

            The Mountain at her side thing; that was stupid. I’ll start a new chain.

          • Timcharger

            Josh citing, “Dany didn’t go directly to the Red Keep because…”

            Isn’t this equally as guilty? If defensive-fan-fiction needs to be written, isn’t that a problem? If we need to add extra into the writing, that factually wasn’t in the show, that’s a good thing?

            What’s in the show is Tyrion continued folly to try to get Cersei to surrender. What’s not in the show is the reason why Dany didn’t go straight for the Red Keep. Let’s dismiss the criticism of what exists in the show, and let’s fix to the missing parts not in the show?

            And even that defensive-fan-fiction is suspect. Cersei doesn’t care about the people. Now this theory thinks Cersei cares about how those people will mourn for her?

            Cersei hurts Dany by murdering Missandei, someone Dany cares about. This theory has Dany murdering people Cersei doesn’t care about, in a way to hurt Cersei?

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Cersei doesn’t care about the people, but she does care about being queen. Daenerys is showing her that she’s queen of nothing but ash.

          • Timcharger

            These mad queens are so poetic. Cersei only wants Tyrion killed with a poetic crossbow. Dany wants Cersei to know the poetic metaphor of being the queen of ash. In a different world, these 2 girls would be best friends sharing their love for puns and wordplay. Little known fact: Dany and Cersei’s both share the same favorite book, The Phantom Tollbooth.
            🙂

  3. Jane

    “What the criticisms also don’t take into consideration is that Daenerys didn’t actually go insane, but rather knew exactly what she was doing. She had decided earlier in the episode that she’d never win the love of the people and the only way to rule was by fear. As a Targaryen, that’s a philosophy she’d been taught since birth. As much as she tried to reject it until now, recent events convinced her of its validity. (…) Nevertheless, I feel like I’m out of step with a lot of Game of Thrones fandom this season. ”

    You feel out of step because you’re not paying attention to details. Daenerys didn’t just destroy the city, she (by extension of her dragon) was specifically aiming the fire at women and children trying to run away. This is absolutely not what the Targaryen “philosophy” is about. Go read the books, and read up on the history of House Targaryen. With the exception of the Mad King and a few others, the Targaryens were for the most part just rulers.

    In other words, you are not a true fan of the series otherwise you’d have realized this.

    • Timcharger

      “she (by extension of her dragon) was specifically aiming the fire at women and children trying to run away.”

      That’s what the show focused on showing us. There were Lannister soldiers running in those alleyways too. Those red uniforms are there. And the writers also showed the Northern army was just as capable of raping and pillaging, too. The bombing runs by war planes is the same story in our history. There are innocents along with legitimate war targets.

      • Josh Zyber
        Author

        Further, the episode focused on the women and children dying because the show-runners wanted us to see the collateral damage, to understand that this wasn’t a surgical military strike to take out the enemy. She indiscriminately killed everyone.

        It wasn’t to say that she only targeted women and children. How would that even be possible?

    • Josh Zyber
      Author

      Oh dearie me, I’m not a true fan, despite having recapped every single episode of this show in exhausting detail since the beginning. Right, that makes sense. Glad you cleared that up for me.

      • Jane

        Well, now that you mentioned it: I do remember your recaps, especially the ones where at the end of season 2 you criticized the whole of GoT for the zombies-at-the-tree scene and wrote, to quote, that “the show jumped the shark”. 6 seasons later you suddenly found yourself amazed at the endless zombie fights.

        Could it be that your “conversion” is simply a matter of commercial consideration, and that you want to cash in on the hype? That’s a rhetorical question, of course.

        • Josh Zyber
          Author

          Riiiiiight. My writing lengthy articles about 72 episodes of television was all an elaborate long con to collect the tiny pittance of money that being an internet blogger brings in. What a score! I really fooled you suckers, huh?

    • Timcharger

      “This is absolutely not what the Targaryen “philosophy” is about.”

      How does one judge a dynasty? By what the “average” ruler did? The highs and lows? Sure there were wonderful Targaryen kings. But they started with dragons melting castles to gain power across the continent. They ended with a mad king wanting to wildfire the entire city. They had a bloody civil war within the Targaryen family tree, too. The show is telling us that a closer examination of “just rulers” reveals quite a bit of injustice.

    • Csm101

      In all fairness, the show is being recapped and not the books. From what I understand, they are two very different entities at this point.

  4. I’ve been baffled by the fan hate from this season. Everything that has happened thus far has been completely fitting for the series. Like Josh says, the character behaviors have been laid out for some time now.

    I can’t wait to see how it concludes this Sunday!

  5. Timcharger

    Jaime’s Arc

    So if you’re handsome and nice to 2 people, you can be redeemed?

    That’s all it takes, be a good guy to Tyrion and Brienne, only 2 people in the whole realm, that makes you a beloved character? The show ended him as registered sex offender, who cannot quit his addiction to twincest. Guess it sure helps when the 2 people you are nice to, is a little person and the purest girl-power personification in the 7 Kingdoms, some fans will consider you redeemed.

    Gonna argue that Jaime went North to save everyone in the realm? Jaime only went after he learned that Cersei trusted Euron (with her Golden Company plans) more than she did with Jaime. Seems more like a scorned lover than a chivalrous oathkeeper.

    Never bought into Jaime’s redemption. Glad that the show went the subversion route to trick Jaime’s fans.

    • Josh Zyber
      Author

      That’s a pretty gross simplification of Jaime’s character arc. He’s a complicated, conflicted character, and was never actually “redeemed.” The show made a point of reminding us, even as recent as the last episode, that he’s done terrible things and is not actually a good person. He can be neither purely good nor purely bad.

      I didn’t say it was Jaime’s motivation to save everyone in the realm. That was Tyrion’s motivation for sending him, but all Jaime ever really cared about was Cersei. Tyrion knew this, and also knew that Cersei cared about Jaime above all else. He hoped that he could use that to his advantage.

      • Timcharger

        There are Jaime fans who cheered his “redemption.” They thought till the last moment that Jaime was there to kill Cersei. That he only left Brienne saying those mean things to keep Brienne safe in Winterfell.

        He’s the subversion to the bad-guy character who is devilishly handsome, but just ran in the wrong circles. But once he get a taste of good-girl lips (or other heroine’s body parts) he would choose the redeemed side. Jaime climbed the mountain of Brienne, but afterwards still preferred Cersei’s (pit, trench, cavity, depression, borehole [pick the least offensive word to you]).

  6. Timcharger

    Is bells a thing?

    When has it been established that ringing bells is the waving white flag of Westeros? Maybe I missed something in the past 7 seasons, but when is violating bells-ringing considered a big no-no?

    The show makes a big deal about how guests invited in with bread and salt, that’s a thing in realms. The gods don’t take kindly to deceiving castle guests. It’s not the Red Wedding murders that’s the problem; it’s that it violates the Airbnb user agreement.

    So bells are a thing? It’s not the invasion, death, or destruction. That’s all fair in war. But what happens are the ring tone, that’s what is unfair in war?

    —–

    And even if bell-war-rules are a thing, the show has not established that was communicated to the Lannisters, to Cersei, to Qyburn, to the city guard captains. All we know about the bell rules is what Tyrion told to Dany, to Grey Worm, to Jon, to Jaime. There’s no evidence that Jaime was even able to tell anyone in King’s Landing that Team Dragon pre-agreed to the bells-rules. The stopping at the bells plan, that was inside Tyrion’s fan fiction version of the invasion.

    Heck, for all we know, it was noon. And the bells were just counting out 12 chimes.

  7. Timcharger

    Josh: “Cersei would also be expecting assassination attempts and would be prepared for them. (The Mountain never left her side.)”

    Josh: “they’re stopped in a stairwell by the Hound, who kills their Kingsguard escort. The Mountain steps forward and ignores Cersei’s order to stay by her side.”

    They are on 1 staircase, traveling in 1 direction. It was not a fork in the road. Cersei wasn’t going to backtrack up the stairs.
    The Mountain moving a few steps forward is defending his queen. The Hound was not 50 yards away, so the Mountain would not be “abandoning” Cersei by approaching the Hound. The other Queens-guards moved forward to fight the Hound without complaint from Cersei and Qyburn.

    It’s like the dialogue was written before it was decided that Clegane Bowl would be on a staircase.

    • Timcharger

      Dany could win. That’s possible.

      Maybe another parallel back to Season 1. Instead of Joffrey, it’s Dany as the Queen standing before the public square. Instead of Ned Stark, it’s Jon on his knees. Grey Worm is holding Jon’s sword, Long Claw above Jon’s head. Arya like back in Season 1, is in the audience. The show ends with the blade severing Jon’s neck. Or maybe Arya leaps out from the crowd…

      • cardpetree

        Dany tries to execute Jon by ordering Drogon to burn him. Jon doesn’t burn and Arya jumps in to kill Dany.

          • Csm101

            I had a slightly different theory. I don’t think Jon is fire proof, but I thought Dany would order “Dracarys” on Jon and Drogon would not oblige. That would’ve kissed her off even more. Anyways, none of that shit happened but it’s always fun to play “what if”.

    • Tmcharger

      We see an adult Bran walk up to little boy Bran, “Hey kid, don’t climb up that tower.”

      Bran rolls his eyes forward and awakes. He sees Samwell nearby writing. “Hey Sam, have I got a story for you.”

    • Timcharger

      Dany’s death? I’m more interested in Tyrion’s fate first. His possible death is what I’m looking forward to see how the show resolves this.

      Dany could just say, “I meant the next, NEXT time you fail me would be your last.” Since Dany didn’t officially say “starting now,” it’s difficult to determine a proclamation’s exact starting time. At midnight? The next day? Maybe Tyrion released Jaime before the rule went into effect?

  8. matt

    Loved the episode and loving the season. Long time book fan here. For those who still have faith Martin could write a better conclusion…you’ve obviously forgotten what it was like reading Dance with Dragons when it came out 47 years ago.

    btw, Timcharger? Eeaaaasssy, boy.

  9. Guy

    Everybody pays way too much attention to the rabid fringes on these things. Anybody that says this show is garbage now has never actually seen a garbage TV show.

    But whereas Game of Thrones was almost always a 8, 9 or 10 out of 10 show for many years, it’s been a 6, 7 or 8 out of 10 show at times the last two seasons. The nutbag internet forgets there’s anything below a 5 on a ten-point scale, so episodes that have flaws and are overall just okay are the worst things ever to them.

    Because that bunch is so annoying, some others are lumping folks with valid, measured criticisms in with the nutbar brigade. “That’s all there was to the Night King?” “You’re a misogynist who hates strong women like Arya and needs to learn to calibrate your television.”

    I’m getting annoyed by the super pro and super con crowd at this point. They’re strawmanning each other and trying to drag everyone else in with them.

    • Timcharger

      Being nuanced to say a 9-10 show has been a 7-8 lately, I see that.

      But at the same time, some of that hate sadly is from misogynists. It’s amazing how much GoT’s appeal crosses the political spectrum. I watch the show thinking that it has such strong messages of a particular political ideology, only to be talking to a fellow sports bar patron who saw it completely different I’m amazed at how many fans I see that clearly were the type who would have been beating up the GRRM nerd who checked out fantasy books at the school library.

  10. Timcharger

    Josh: “One of Varys’ little bird spies notifies him that the queen hasn’t eaten in days, leaving an impression that perhaps he’s been trying to poison her.”

    It’s not spelled out to every viewer, but I think it’s clear that Varys was actively trying to kill Dany with poison. From memory, “we’ll try again at supper” and the “greater the risk, the greater the reward” pep talk to the kitchen servant girl, clarifies that plot point for me. Plus it makes sense, that for Varys this is the final minutes of the ballgame. No time for caution (time to listen to that Zimmer Interstellar score again), which helps explain how this master of the game was playing so recklessly. His conversation with Jon was a Hail Mary pass. Unlike Tyrion with the same stupid play to appeal to Cersei for the Nth time, Varys put his life on the line to use poison to try save hundreds of thousands of innocent lives.

    Tyrion telling Varys that it was him; that was a great scene. But it should have been followed with Jon also admitting, “Hey Varys the moment I walked into the castle, I had to tell Dany. You know that I can’t keeps secrets. Open, honest candor, that’s is my schtick! So no, Tyrion, I told Dany first. Varys, it was me.”

  11. Timcharger

    Josh: “Tyrion asks Davos to smuggle something for him, but we don’t get to learn what it was just yet.”

    So Davos took 2 boats to that secret cove and left an empty dinghy there? Davos was back in time for the daytime assault on the city; he fought beside Jon for the most part. So Tyrion’s plan for Jaime & Cersei was effectively the Gendry-go-row-across-the-ocean plan? I would love to have seen Jaime pointing to his golden hand, and Cersei having to do the rowing. Too bad Tyrion’s clever plan wasn’t successful.

  12. Joseph Levitt

    “After watching it, the biggest question I had is what the show’s seemingly countless disgruntled fans would find to complain about in this one”
    THAT! was your biggest question? Why am I not surprised.

    The demise of Cersei and Jaime was an incredible wasted opportunity. Brienne should have killed Jaime and, of course, Arya should have killed Cersei—THE MOST EVIL WOMAN IN WESTEROS!!!!
    The Hound and the Mountain battle was ridiculously long and also…boring.
    More than HALF of this episode was devoted to Dragon destroying Kings Landing. Are you kidding me???
    Call me a hater, but this episode, indeed this ENTIRE season has been a complete copout. Devoid of intelligent writing and basically putting a Hollywood ending on this series. My kingdom for the final two books…

    • Charles M

      She was killed. What does it matter by whom or by what? I mean, it would’ve been great if Hitler had been caught, put on trial and executed. but that didn’t happen.

      • Shannon Nutt

        Because this is supposed to be entertainment, not real-life. If every show was real-life, we’d be bored as viewers.

        • Charles M

          If this was just entertainment Rob Stark would’ve lived and won. Ned would’ve survived to rescue his daughters. All the bad guys would lose. I thought the entire point of this show was that it was more realistic than other type of fantasy shows.
          She’s dead, she lost. Why does she need to be killed by a sword? It makes no sense. Sandor himself made a good point about that.

  13. Timcharger

    “Brienne should have killed Jaime”???

    For taking her virginity and going back his ex-girlfriend? That’s probably justified in every teenage daughter’s father’s code of justice, but that’s not really a capital crime.

    “Arya should have killed Cersei—THE MOST EVIL WOMAN IN WESTEROS!!!!”
    Arya not killing Cersei was probably a better choice among the events of what would provide either surprise or fan service. Can’t have an imbalance of too much fan wet dreams. If Jaime is to tragically fall back into Cersei’s arms, writing Arya as the killer, would suggest she also kills Jaime. So that might have been the issue.

    As for the title of the Most Evil Woman in Westeros, you might want to rewatch this episode. You might notice something different in a 2nd viewing. In sheer numbers of kills racked up, Cersei’s Sept of Baelor event was rather puny in comparison. Dany is only pointing to the scoreboard.

    • Timcharger

      Typo: comment meant as reply to above grouping. But WordPress doesn’t fix this grouping structure easily, right?

  14. Timcharger

    Missing Reunion

    Not a reunion in person, but perhaps some “reunion” through some character dialogue, we were not given a Varys and Littlefinger reunion. There was a point several seasons back that those 2 were possibly the most important people in the realm.

    We didn’t get any commentary or reaction from Varys about Littlefinger’s death, before Varys’ time expired. Maybe something in the end where Varys comments that Littlefinger misplayed a young girl, Sansa, and that resulted in Baelish’s death. And Varys wonders if he misplayed a young girl, Dany, that would result in his own death.

    Just seems like there was more juice to squeeze out from those 2 great ripe characters, Baelish and Varys.

  15. Charles M

    I had no problem with Dany and what the writers chose to do with her. I disagree with the idea that Dany was not capable of this type of thing or that it wasn’t set up before hand. The first person she kills all the way back in the last episode of season one was an old lady who had been raped and taken into slavery by Dothraki. She executed hundreds of people and took great pleasure into it.

    People say she’s never done something like this, well yeah, if she did we’d all hate her and wouldn’t understand why any other characters liked her. That’s the point, she’s someone who could’ve seemed to be a great ruler. It was effective, I was on the edge of my seats when the bells were ringing.

    There’s also her speech to Tyrion earlier in the episode where she compares the people of King’s Landing to the people of Meereen and says something like how the people of Meereen were happy to see her. In her mind, and also Grey Worm’s mind, these people are NOT behaving like their ideas of what people under slavery are supposed to behave like. For Dany and Greyworm. the people of King’s Landing are the Other.

    Also, it is possible to sympathize with some people but not care about other kind of people. Like, anti-abortionists who say killing a child is wrong no matter what, but yet support a war where kids are killed.

    It’s not the writer’s fault if people have selective memory or were untroubled by a lot of the choices Dany made. Me personally, I’ve always considered a lot of her actions as unjustified especially that old lady from S1. Thought it was needlessly cruel. Even her destroying slaves cities smacked of colonialism.

    The only few things I hated were Jaime and Euron fighting. Why? What did that serve in the story? Was anyone waiting for a showdown between them? Jaime’s arc was a bit anti-climatic. As someone who defended the writers delaying Jaime’s breakaway from Cersei, I can’t defend this. Arya and Sandor having a change of heart after what must have been months of travel I didn’t like.

  16. Timcharger

    Easy fix to this problem:

    In 8.4, scorpions 2.0 > dragons
    In 8.5, scorpions 2.0 < dragon

    Around the battlefield play table at Dragonstone's war room…
    Grey Worm: "How will we attack now that they have these new scorpion weapons?"
    Tyrion: "After having a closer look when I approached the castle wall, the new scorpions are much more heavy and powerful. When we attacked the loot train, the previous scorpion was mobile and manned by a single archer. These new ones are so powerful, 4 or more soldiers guide each of them."
    Grey Worm, looking upset: "So we must keep our distance and steer away from them."
    Dany: "No. I will fly even closer. I have no fear."
    Grey Worm gives an incredulous look.
    Tyrion nods with a smile.

    This quick fix, leaves enough mystery at the first impression. But when thinking back after the castle is attacked, it solves the problem by using the design of the scorpions 2.0 against itself. They are too powerful, too heavy, too slow to aim at close shifting targets. And this fix finally demonstrates some value to Dany for Tyrion's brain.

      • Timcharger

        No Josh, it “leaves enough mystery at the first impression.”

        Dialogue written with the audience following Grey Worm’s perspective that was focused on how powerful (not how heavy) the new scorpions are.

        Dany’s “closer with no fear” response seems more like bravado than a sound strategy capitalizing on the scorpion’s slow maneuverability.

        My fix was written intentionally to address that concern you made. Pls re-read.

        • Josh Zyber
          Author

          All of that can already be inferred from watching the scene and doesn’t need to be stated in thudding dialogue.

          Rhaegal died because the Iron Fleet caught Dany by surprise. The same can be said about the attack at the Loot Train. Dany was prepared this time and came with a clear attack strategy. You can see that in the episode. It doesn’t need to be explained further.

          • Timcharger

            Apparently you missed the haters’ complaints about how easy Euron got Rhaegal, and how easy Drogon destroyed all the city’s defenses. Granted, the complaints about Dany’s turn are so deafening so it’s difficult to hear the other hate.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            The fact that Daenerys fell into such an obvious trap set by Euron is a legitimate complaint. In fact, I made it last week.

            Having learned from that mistake, however, Daenerys went into the next battle with a better strategy. Drogon easily destroyed the city’s defenses as he well should have, because HE’S A FUCKING DRAGON. The dragons were always an overpowered and underutilized weapon at Daenerys’ disposal. When used properly, nothing can stop them. The circumstances of Dany losing her second dragon are what was contrived in order to give the impression that the fight was evenly-matched when it never should have been.

          • Timcharger

            I disagree about “nothing can stop them (dragons).” (Damn, we’re such nerds!)

            If Qyburn didn’t replace scorpions 1.0 with 2.0, but instead used both; that would be a solution. New scorpions for long range power. Older scorpions for short range speed. Mount both types of scorpions across the city defenses. Much of our war history has these follies where war technology focused too much on power and long range capability where the nimble, less powerful war tech won the battle. So there’s historical significance to this point, beyond talking about killing dragons.

            (We’re both gonna get beaten up after school today, Josh.)

          • Timcharger

            In the Loot Train episode, Dany did use Drogon to his full ability, yet a single archer with a scorpion 1.0 did knock Drogon out of the sky. So the evidence is in the show (not just fan fiction). Qyburn made a tactical war technology mistake, but not utilizing both types of scorpions, and Dany capitalized on that error by sweeping and changing directions in close fly-bys. If Qyburn could build 50 scorpion 2.0s, he should have been able to build 25 each instead.

            And noticing this maneuverability flaw of the scorpion 2.0, would be in Tyrion’s wheelhouse; so if that would be great to pit the 2 Hands of Queens against each other. And Tyrion would finally demonstrate some brainpower, so there’s value to having this scene of strategizing against the new scorpion 2.0 in the show.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            The scorpion was a total surprise to Daenerys in the Loot Train battle. She had no idea that the Lannisters had any sort of dragon-killing weapon, and wasn’t prepared for the need to evade it. She didn’t know what it was until it fired on her.

            This time, she knew about the scorpions and had a strategy for how to get around them. One of the points the episode makes is that she didn’t need Tyrion for this. She won this war all by herself. Destroying the city was a message not just to her enemies, but to Tyrion and Jon Snow and anyone else in her camp that she doesn’t need any of them, and the same treatment will come to them if they think of betraying her.

          • Timcharger

            Let’s digest…

            (Josh) You made a point that nothing can stop dragons, when you “fully utilize” them “properly.”
            (Tim) I cited evidence that the Loot Train deployment was full rage, entire-can-of-spinach utilization, yet one scorpion 1.0 WAS ABLE to knock down Drogon.
            (Josh) You said that was only due to surprise, but now Dany knows scorpions exist and she has a strategy to evade them.
            (Josh) You made a new point that Dany didn’t need help from Tyrion, from Jon, from anyone to overcome the scorpions, to win the war all by herself.

            Let’s me first respond to the needing help part. Whether Dany needed help or not, that’s awfully convenient to argue that AFTER Arya killed the Night King. Dany’s goal wasn’t to conquer King’s Landing only to lose it when undead travel south.

            Josh: “This time, she knew about the scorpions and had a strategy for how to get around them.”

            That strategy is really just dodging the scorpion bolts. It’s always been the same strategy. Fan theory that Drogon would get some amazing Gendry armor didn’t happen, so no new strategy. She got lucky that Qyburn didn’t also employ dozens of 1st generation scorpions that are mobile and quick to aim throughout the city defenses. The evidence of the success of having just 1 scorpion 1.0 is in the show.

          • Josh Zyber
            Author

            Scorpion 1.0 was only successful because Dany didn’t see it coming. The thing hit her before she even knew what it was. The dragons have enough agility and range of attack to dodge any scorpion if they’re not caught by surprise.

          • Timcharger

            Josh: “Scorpion 1.0 was only successful because Dany didn’t see it coming.”

            Josh, that isn’t what is in the Loot Train episode. Unlike what happened with Rhaegal & the 2.0 scorpion, Bronn hit Drogon after missing first, IIRC. So it was not a surprise attack on Dany that enabled the successful hit. After Dany dodged a bolt, Bronn had to reload and hit with the next attempt.

            We can only argue with what evidence is in the show. Dragons a mile away, that aren’t swerving, 2.0 was successful. Dragons swooping around close enough to be in breathing fire distance, 1.0 was successful.

            Saying that 20, 30 1.0 scorpions defending King’s Landing would definitely not stop Drogon at all, that’s an extreme position not supported by what happened in other episodes of the show.

  17. Shannon Nutt

    You can argue that Jaime and Cersei got a deserving fate, but I don’t agree that their character arcs came to the right end. Somewhere along the way in our overall TV and movie entertainment, “fan service” became a BAD thing, when it should be a GOOD thing…isn’t that what you’re trying to do – please the audience and not alienate them? I understand trying to subvert expectations, but when a series does that over and over and over again, it becomes annoying.

    Lena Headey was given NOTHING to do in this final season after being one of the best actresses on the show for eight seasons. If I were here, I’d be PISSED.

    • I never assume that anyone is dead unless you see their dead bodies – and they left a few bad guys questionably dead in this episode (Euron, Cersei, and Jamie). I think we’re bound to get more of Euron and I wouldn’t be surprised is Cersei is still kicking.

      • Timcharger

        I’d be surprised if Euron and Cersei are still kicking. I’d bet you a fake HDD dollar. If you’re kidding Luke, you gotta put more sarcasm in your writing, maybe a scarcasm emoji?

    • Timcharger

      Shannon, some fan service is good. By most accounts, Clegane Bowl was a success in delivering service to fans.

      Too much fan service isn’t good either. Qyburn’s quick death from nowhere. Heralded Golden Company dispatched quickly.
      Cersei not getting killed by Arya. These non-fan-service turns were good choices.

      Should Lena Headey have more scenes? Hell ya. 10 episodes each for the last 2 seasons should have been the call. That’s entirely Benioff and Weiss’ fault. HBO certainly gave them enough $ to be able to do it. Maybe too many complaints about Arya’s training or Dany’s adventures in Meereen lead them to the wrong decision for these last 2 seasons.

    • Charles M

      There’s nothing to give Lena Headey. She reached her limit of character development when killed all those people. We’ve had eight seasons with her in great scenes, that’s enough.

      When Brienne defeated Sandor, people attacked the show for being fan service. Having characters who don’t meet up in the book but meet up in the show was criticised for being fan service.

      But how do you define fan service? Do you think all fans want the same thing? Am I not fan because I was happy with Cersei’s death and thought Cleganbowl was silly and unnecessary? Which fans do you service?

      • Timcharger

        “She reached her limit of character development when killed all those people. ”
        Apparently, kill count limits may be higher than you think.

        “We’ve had eight seasons with her in great scenes, that’s enough.”
        The issue is that she had very little scenes in the 8th season. Why keep her around for this season, when she was in very little of it. No one is saying to have a 9th season of just her.

        “But how do you define fan service?… Which fans do you service?”
        One way is to ask just 1 fan, you? Or me? Or perhaps a better way is the general consensus of fans. There’s enough social media that easily accessible to get a sense of what most fans are excited for. I may want to see how many chickens the Hound can actually eat, but my guess is that most fans don’t want an episode of the Hound killing every patron of Hot Pie’s restaurant just to eat their chicken dinner plates.

      • Shannon Nutt

        Considering she was getting over $1 million for each of these 6 episodes, you’d think they’d want to get a return on their money…I heard she was mad about what they did with her character, but honestly, she should be laughing as that’s the easiest $6 million she’ll ever make.

  18. Plissken99

    I must admit when I first saw the episode, I really thought they’d Last Jedi’d the whole thing. But on second viewing and trying to consider everything Dany has been through, I could see her going that way.

    From a writing standpoint this season is undeniably the weakest, but the main thread remains. I’m still a fan.

      • Plissken99

        Battle of the Bastards remains the most intense battle I’ve seen. Every season has been strong IMO.

        It should also be noted that all of this could be avoided by Jon manning up and banging his hot aunt again.

        • Timcharger

          We don’t have much further to go, women. We, men, we’re almost woke.

          I have heard that “Jon-manning-up” point from fellow patrons at drinking establishments. I have also noted who to not allow to date my sister, despite the fact that I don’t have sisters.
          🙂

  19. Art A

    Wow…look at all the comments, etc. We can complain all we want about story arcs, abandoning favored actors or watching them stand around like logs in these final episodes (Yes, I’m talking to you, Varys), loose ends, plotline MacGuffins (White Walkers), and yet…again…look at all these comments.

    Have we seen this type of involvement and fascination with a weekly series in recent memory? Maybe the last time I can remember anything like this was The Sopranos. Complain all you want, but this series will go down as one of the great ones in television history.

    I don’t know where Sunday’s conclusion is going to lead us, and I’m quite sure some of the resolution is really going to piss me off, but more than anything else, I’m most pissed off that its ending. That’s the ultimate test, isnt it?

  20. Joe Carnevali

    “The stallion who mounts the world will burn no cities now. His khalasar shall trample no nations into dust.” Interesting that Arya mounted the horse after Daenery destroyed the city.

    • Timcharger

      Haven’t we learned the problem of interpreting prophecies? Our religious leaders misinterpreting them; that’s a constant theme with GRRM. Get a little detail wrong, an innocent daughter gets burned at a stake, or a tyrant justifies genocide in her conquest for power.

  21. Timcharger

    This explains it; it’s all good now.

    Pavlov’s Dragon

    Everytime the the dragons were being fed, Dany or the Unsullied rang a bell. Bell rings, it’s dinner time. And back in Winterfell we saw the charred bones of goats & sheep. The dragons liked their meat medium, medium-well.

    So stupid, stupid Tyrion. Having bells ring throughout King’s Landing?! Every bell tower was burnt to the ground. Drogon kept searching street by street, where are my lamb chops? Dany didn’t eat for days, so Drogon, mourning Rhaegal, didn’t eat for days too.

    The entire back 1/3rd of the episode, we never saw Dany’s face again after the bells were rung. All that time, she kept telling Drogon, no, this bell, that bell, they aren’t signaling dinner time. It’s science. It’s Pavlov; can’t break science rules.

    Now we’re trained. When we hear bells in future TV shows; we’ll salivate anticipating a rushed character turn.

  22. Timcharger

    In retrospect it’s pretty obvious…
    (Jaime not Dany)

    Ladies, when striking up a conversation with a guy in a hot tub, is he going to make up lies? Tell you how he saved kittens, or half of King’s Landing? Jaime saying that he cared for the downtrodden masses, that’s clearly debunked.

    Ladies, GRRM & showrunners are saying when a guy boss gives you a promotion, elevates you to knighthood, he’s really thinking about another sword to place on you. Career advancement without workplace harassment, not possible even in fantasy.

    Using alcohol. His wingman, Tyrion wants to play an innocent drinking game. Wine from Dorne to lower your inhibitions. Highborn Jaime in his frat party days learned that enough drinks equals consent.

    Brienne did know about Jaime’s twincest right? She must have known, no? Did the show always put Brienne in a position to have that information in her blindspot?

    So when Brienne is crying her sad story to Sansa, Sansa will clarify:
    You believed a hot tub story that he saved millions, the night after he gave you a promotion he went to your room, you knew he bought you at least 6 drinks, and you knew that he sleeps with his sister???

    • Timcharger

      Let me clarify, this is not hate on Brienne.

      This is how Jaime’s story arc’s ending changed Brienne’s arc.

      Brienne being the winner of episode 8.2, the Knight of the Seven Kingdoms; that must be seen in an entirely different light now.

    • Timcharger

      Jaime does Brienne, and Tyrion had to…

      So in the previous episode, the showrunners had to write a scene about the 2 frat brothers discussing post sex details. Tyrion said he’s a deviant imp and needs to ask Jaime what’s it like humping a giant?

      If the showrunners are going to do that, then they should have wrote the most obvious question. Tyrion needs to ask Jaime about the elephant in the room. Or rather, ask about the one who wished there were elephants. Tyrion should have asked, “Jaime, what’s f*cking your twin sister like?”

      Seriously, if Tyrion loves Jaime so much, why hasn’t he attempted to intervene in Jaime’s addiction? This episode proved that Jaime is on a self-destructive road with Cersei.

      • Timcharger

        Brienne the DUFF? Maybe Jaime was only trying to get closer to Brienne’s hot friend, Sansa?

        Or did you mean, because he only had one hand. And Jaime had a hard time “stroking his sword” with his left hand. So Brienne took pity on him?

  23. Timcharger

    Largest Crowd Ever to Witness a Coronation Period!

    Dany gets crowned the Queen, and host the largest crowd ever. Any reports that King’s Landing’s population was halved, that was Fake Ravens! Some say It may have been the greatest coronation of all time, greatest since Aegon Tarygaryen, the George Washington of Westeros, many have said.

    Fake Ravens report that Dany wears a false hair braid, as it now has grown bigly-er than ever.

    Queen Dany saved the city. You know it, and I know it. We all know that the previous queen, Dany calls her Winey Cersei, destroyed the Sept of Baelor with wildfire. So Dany was able to use her dragon to blow out the wildfires Winey Cersei started and saved half the city. All hail Queen Dany!

    Fake Ravens continue to report about the atrocities by the Dothraki and Unsullied during the Liberation of King’s Landing. But Queen Dany proclaims that there were very fine people on both sides. There were bad, very bad hombres of commoners who attacked the peaceful Dothraki and Unsullied.

    Why doesn’t this victor also get to rewrite history (or herstory)?

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